Author Topic: Is It bad form?  (Read 1273 times)

Offline TameRlane

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Is It bad form?
« on: December 15, 2016, 09:29:20 PM »
Is It bad form to copy a deck build?

example:
 two players are matched against each other with relatively the same deck except for several design choices that both players had to make.
 Player A wins the match and after chatting about each others deck build Player B sees where the deck he's using can be improved based off of watching (and Losing to) a better version of his deck.
Is It bad form for Player B to improve his deck based off of Player A's build?

How does this apply to the optimization of meta decks? 

How else to improve w/o noticing better strats and combos and adjusting accordingly?
It's the Pilot not the Vehicle right?

Thanks in advance
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Offline largenuggets [BoD]

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2016, 09:39:06 PM »
That's far from bad form, in fact I would say it is encouraged. This is how a meta becomes established in a game like this. Even better is if both players test decks against each other and both take things away from each other's deck, which is something me and ES like to do sometimes. Copying and improving on other people's decks is a pretty essential part of TCG's in general imo.

Offline MerliniX

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2016, 09:59:33 PM »
I copy 100% of my decks from the internet. I have never built an original deck in my life.

Offline largenuggets [BoD]

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2016, 10:06:24 PM »
I copy 100% of my decks from the internet. I have never built an original deck in my life.

I knew that was coming :P

Offline TameRlane

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2016, 10:58:49 PM »
thanks guys !
MAY ALL YOUR PENTA PACKS HAVE LEGENDS AND MAY ALL YOUR RIFT RUNS BE REWARDING!
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Offline ORISOLVE

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #5 on: December 16, 2016, 01:52:02 AM »
I would say it is frowned upon. If you just continue a cycle of deck copying and improving upon the copied deck, then there is no innovation, and that leads to a dull meta of everyone playing the same thing.

"If you improve upon garbage, it is still garbage."

Not that deck copying is entirely your fault, because it is mainly Lightmare/Yodo1's fault for designing such an imbalanced game where favoritism is clearly shown towards certain deck types and factions. In my opinion it is bad form, but the developers have not left you much with a choice.

You are a thief. The pilot just sits there and turns on auto-pilot. The vehicle is everything. Once you reach the skill cap, the game is 100% RNG.

How do you sleep at night, you netdeckers!  :)
« Last Edit: December 16, 2016, 02:06:53 AM by ORISOLVE »
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Offline Hiding

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #6 on: December 16, 2016, 02:56:05 AM »
I would say it is frowned upon. If you just continue a cycle of deck copying and improving upon the copied deck, then there is no innovation, and that leads to a dull meta of everyone playing the same thing.

"If you improve upon garbage, it is still garbage."

Not that deck copying is entirely your fault, because it is mainly Lightmare/Yodo1's fault for designing such an imbalanced game where favoritism is clearly shown towards certain deck types and factions. In my opinion it is bad form, but the developers have not left you much with a choice.

You are a thief. The pilot just sits there and turns on auto-pilot. The vehicle is everything. Once you reach the skill cap, the game is 100% RNG.

How do you sleep at night, you netdeckers!  :)

Well the skill you describe applies only for deckbuilding. Its pretty inevitable in any card game except maybe clash royale. Gameplay wise is another skill. In this game it isnt always straightwfoward what plays to make so this is another component tot the skill. Of course it depends on the game mechanics whether it is skill or not.

Offline ES [BoD]

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2016, 04:06:17 PM »
That's far from bad form, in fact I would say it is encouraged. This is how a meta becomes established in a game like this. Even better is if both players test decks against each other and both take things away from each other's deck, which is something me and ES like to do sometimes. Copying and improving on other people's decks is a pretty essential part of TCG's in general imo.
+1 and besides, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery  ;D
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Offline Vuurjopi

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2016, 04:41:49 PM »
In my oppinion there is only one thing better than finding a great combo.
And that is when someone else implements your combo in their own deck.
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Offline Ben4d90

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2016, 08:31:18 PM »
Not at all. There's no shame in using what works, and everyone makes their own personal tweaks to their decks anyway. I have done it myself; Last month, before Feartrops was nerfed, I was running that deck in ranked for a good while. I ran into a player using 2DoD/1EX who destroyed me so I decided to copy the idea of the deck and make my own. I subsequently ran that in ranked and found myself getting a lot of wins because it was strong against most of the meta decks.

If you are making your own decks and messing around with idea's, stick to normal. But, if you are playing ranked and serious about reaching the top, you absolutely need to be running a strong, optimised deck to get consistant wins and, even then, you actually need to be skilled and understand the deck to use it well. Copying a top tier deck isn't enough on it's own. I've faced plenty of low ranked players that were running meta decks such as feartrops, tinkercide, mechborn aggro etc and destroyed them because they simply weren't that skilled.

I would say it is frowned upon. If you just continue a cycle of deck copying and improving upon the copied deck, then there is no innovation, and that leads to a dull meta of everyone playing the same thing.

"If you improve upon garbage, it is still garbage."

Not that deck copying is entirely your fault, because it is mainly Lightmare/Yodo1's fault for designing such an imbalanced game where favoritism is clearly shown towards certain deck types and factions. In my opinion it is bad form, but the developers have not left you much with a choice.

You are a thief. The pilot just sits there and turns on auto-pilot. The vehicle is everything. Once you reach the skill cap, the game is 100% RNG.

How do you sleep at night, you netdeckers!  :)

"Hurr durr copy a meta deck to get easy wins, game is autopilot guise!"

Seriously man, you are becoming somewhat of a joke these days with your opinions. It's really hard to take you seriously anymore. I mean, I agree that Death Blast needs a nerf since it is currently the undisputed strongest deck and nerfing that alone would allow for far more variety of decks to be viable, but that's as far as it goes.

Oh, and, the huge puffying irony of your post is that you, at one point, stated that you were going to reach the top of ranked using "your own GI deck" which was, surprise surprise, just a variation of the old top tier deck, Valuebots. I played against you with my 2DoD/Ex deck and, despite using a top tier deck and using cards that made the matchup harder for me (disruption sphere comes to mind) I still beat you. You honestly just chat so much puffy. Actually follow through with what you said; get to top ranked and then come back with a valid opinion.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2016, 08:39:38 PM by Ben4d90 »

Offline TameRlane

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2016, 08:37:24 PM »
 :o oooo  I created in interesting topic! Thanks again everyone!
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Offline Rawonall

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2016, 10:23:21 PM »
There's no need to "net"deck or ask your opponent anything.
As soon as any match is over, you have a card by card list of your opponent's deck available in your game log's folder (some cards take a little work to decode but it's not too hard).
Basically, all you need to do to have a killer list is just to face ES in ranked once and then you are good to go  ::) (btw, that's why ES got my vote for POTY)


Offline belial12

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2016, 11:55:40 PM »
for me, there's no point in playing a game like this if you are just going to net deck.

Offline Hiding

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #13 on: December 19, 2016, 01:14:11 PM »
for me, there's no point in playing a game like this if you are just going to net deck.

Building a deck is only half the game, the other is playing it.

Offline Lautrec

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Re: Is It bad form?
« Reply #14 on: December 19, 2016, 11:02:39 PM »
I have no problems about netdecking, although i think you should still make it unique by adapting it to your playstyle.

On the other hand, if no one tries to make their own decks, the meta will ultimately be permanent and this is where netdecking becomes an issue.
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