Author Topic: Playing draft or buying packs? Which should you choose?  (Read 4033 times)

Offline gagaking

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Re: Playing draft or buying packs? Which should you choose?
« Reply #15 on: November 27, 2015, 08:54:28 PM »
1) Orisolve, How could I make it more user friendly? Any suggestions?

Urza13, here are a few of my questions regarding your proposal:

2) Currently, since I am only comparing the costs of a rift run and buying draft decks to buying packs, I don’t have to consider ip boosts ( buying twice as many packs vs twice as many draft decks still has the same ratio).

However, if I included a % of the time you win in draft vs constructed section, I would have to divide it into what boosts were active. Were you thinking of something like: it would take 925/75= 12.33 extra wins per 3 losses needed for draft with no boost (not counting draft rewards), and then similar calcs for double and triple boosts?

3) People wouldn’t be able to input their expected win % directly into the spreadsheet, so I would have to have some ready made calculations for reference.

While people can download my spreadsheet as an excel file by going to file-download as- Microsoft Excel, and then make it read and write and put in values on their own, thats a lot of trouble for relatively little reward. Unless I’m missing something?

4) From what people have told me, they value easy and quick to understand over absolute accuracy. Also, once again, it can be hard to factor in the extra time from creating the draft deck.

An example of simplicity is the calculation for value of a draft deck, which is actually 30,817- 1,061 per win  (the 29th win takes out 1109ip instead). I put 1070 per win because it is very close most of the time and is easier for quick calculations and understanding.

5) One of these days, I'll learn how to make my responses more concise.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2015, 08:57:34 PM by gagaking »

Offline Urza13

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Re: Playing draft or buying packs? Which should you choose?
« Reply #16 on: November 29, 2015, 08:13:58 AM »
I've made this prototype sheet to show you what I mean:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1sX8Vhd6PhO5MEr6MrnoJl4Wa7Cliq-NNfV3E3-tAr5w/edit?usp=sharing

I use as an example 3 runs that I had.


2) Currently, since I am only comparing the costs of a rift run and buying draft decks to buying packs, I don’t have to consider ip boosts ( buying twice as many packs vs twice as many draft decks still has the same ratio).

However, if I included a % of the time you win in draft vs constructed section, I would have to divide it into what boosts were active. Were you thinking of something like: it would take 925/75= 12.33 extra wins per 3 losses needed for draft with no boost (not counting draft rewards), and then similar calcs for double and triple boosts?

IP boosts mess things up a little, and I must confess I don't understand 100% how/when they work. e.g. at level 20 I used one 100% boost and got 225 for one lose in casual. This week I used two 100% boosters and got 225 IP for lose at casual ¡? I don't get it. Since this sheet is just prototype I'm not considering boosts for now (only the 20-level boost).

3) People wouldn’t be able to input their expected win % directly into the spreadsheet, so I would have to have some ready made calculations for reference.

I think your sheet should allow people to input data. That will also make it more user friendly.

Again, this sheet is just an idea, I think your sheet is very good as it is.

Offline Nehkrimah

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Re: Playing draft or buying packs? Which should you choose?
« Reply #17 on: November 29, 2015, 11:35:51 AM »
Only one activateable IP/XP boost will work at a time, if you use a 100% boost, then use a 25% boost, the last used boost will be the only active one, in this case 25%.

I do know that the level 20 passive boost does stack with the day 5 boost, but not sure how it works with any others.

And the IP you get as rewards from rift runs is simply the IP you would have earned in those matches, just given at the end, so it does count any boosts you had active during those matches, and how long they were.

Offline gagaking

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Re: Playing draft or buying packs? Which should you choose?
« Reply #18 on: November 29, 2015, 05:04:01 PM »
Hi Urza13.

Other issues to consider:
1) the time it takes to input all your individual runs to figure out your win rate is taking away from the time playing the game and enjoying it. The difference in time might be almost/more than enough to counteract the benefit from those calculations.

2) As a side not for your formula for estimated ip: it should be=(E22*150+300)*(D$22+1). It looks like you were using the level 20 boost of 1.5. Also, the 1.5 effects the 300 ip. I am confused why it isn’t matching up perfectly though. I’ll look into it.

3) The reason I don’t make it editable by all viewers is for consistency and reliability. Someone might change something in one of the formulas, and if I didn’t catch it, that might invalidate the calculations. Also, what happens when multiple people are looking and editing the sheet at once?

4) You get the same amount of ip for a loss and win in draft as you do in constructed with a few exceptions:
4A) You get an additional 75 ip* whatever boost you have active when you start,
4B) I don’t know if you get ip for draws in draft, and the length of the games in draft don’t count for ip in draft (needs to be tested some more).
For constructed, you get full ip (150 for a win, 112.5 for a draw and 75 for a loss) * whatever boosts are activated, * % of 5 minutes played. so if the game was 2.5 minutes, you would get half ip, if 3 minutes you would get 60% ip, and if 5+ minutes, you would get full ip.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2015, 05:07:18 PM by gagaking »

Offline Urza13

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Re: Playing draft or buying packs? Which should you choose?
« Reply #19 on: November 29, 2015, 11:24:29 PM »
@Nehkrimah well that explains it, I wasted a bonus  :'(.

@gagaking:

How much time it would take to copy-paste the row and then change IP bonus and number of wins? less that 10 seconds. You can do that while waiting the game to find a match to play. And you only have to modify IP bonus if it wasn't active and you just activate it or vice versa, that's 2 times a week.The thing that may take time is the real IP because you have to sum, but it's optional because the sheet can calculate it accurate.

Yes, all the data is with level 20 bonus, I calculated that "250" based on what you say in your sheet that you get 100 IP for lose in rift, and as I've seen, it seems very accurate. I think there is also some random factor there. The bonus I think is not applied to the 300 IPs, that's why I put it outside in the formula.

My idea is that people download it and edit it in their PCs without changing the original, but now that you mention it, it would be really cool if everyone uses the sheet in google docs and everyone creates their own tab, so you can see how other people are doing and have real examples, just an idea.

Your point 4 is too specific lol, I wanted more accurate results but not that much! anyway over time someone could add an option to register number of ties in the rift and number of ties in constructed, and number of games below 5 min.

Offline gagaking

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Re: Playing draft or buying packs? Which should you choose?
« Reply #20 on: February 25, 2016, 12:28:46 AM »
I may have to massively update this soon... And right after testing 100+ drafts to make sure the rift run probabilities were correct.

Also, increased costs of rift runs means mass testing in the future will be harder.

sigh... At least it means the game isn't dying, and there will finally be premium rewards from drafts!

http://forum.lightmare.com.au/index.php?topic=65779.0

Offline Klassick

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Re: Playing draft or buying packs? Which should you choose?
« Reply #21 on: February 25, 2016, 12:48:25 AM »
I fell your pain... but don't let those changes stop your work! ;)
"Everyone here likes the game. We just hate the devs."
- MerliniX