Poll

Which set do you think was the best?

IW2013
Rise
Infestation
Ascension
Order
Oppression

Author Topic: Best set ever?  (Read 8649 times)

Offline Ragnoraok

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #45 on: June 28, 2015, 02:10:34 AM »
oppression is the best set so far for its originality and because it introduces some new nice mechanics.

but i consider also that oppression is the worst set so far because i find it very unbalanced, there are things i clearly don't undestand, things that are breaking the game :

- avatars
- couting the days
- pacifying winds
- mysterious box
- champion follower
- craps epics and legendaries !
- and on the other side you find that awesome klore !

and so on...

something is wrong, i don't like oppression.

i vote for IW2013

Don't forget Forerunner and Tempus, otherwise I agree that Oppression released a lot of unbalanced cards, particularly in the angel faction.

Offline toon310

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #46 on: June 28, 2015, 09:01:53 AM »
Yep you are right^^ that's why i said :"and so on".

angels's faction 's power increased a lot

Offline toon310

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #47 on: June 28, 2015, 09:22:19 AM »


Pacifying Winds was just changed - do you mean it is still too powerful?

I will agree with you on the BS that is Counting the Days, but the rest of those I don't find unbalanced at all. Might just be me though.


Yes i still think pacifying wind is a bit broken. I had a whole army once destroyed by the combo : shifting stone + winds, that was hilarious :p this was worst before but i still find it a bit op (but i like it ! i like the mechanic ! i like what it brings to dod !). the effect is huge and applies to a lot of characters (for a 4 cost i think).

i won't argue long because i 'm in a hurry right now.

i think a card needs balance when it's hard to find a way to deal with it : eg avatars can't simply die and are a huge threat to decks that doesn't have any removals. put your avatars in the defense zone and let your opponent crush them.. they diedd ? Bah no problem, they come to life again and again unless your opponent has a removal (and not any kind of removal called shot won't work for instance).

same thing for the box :  1p, and nearly a free CTA. How do you want to counter it ?

and angels became so strong... again ! they remind me of the old angels from ascension.

i won't play ranked this season unless i'm forced for my videos (i don't want to break my computer :p). As Ragnoraok said, there are more cards that i could have listed and i think the set needs a lot of balance.

Kidnapped by demons for instance : 1 purity wow :) guess what ? i put 2 in a deck where i already had 3 CTA ^^ the nice joke. I added 3 demonize also rofl ....

Still the new set is fun and introduces a lot of fresh and cool stuff.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2015, 09:24:05 AM by toon310 »

Offline Grinnin_Gin

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #48 on: June 28, 2015, 04:41:33 PM »
I totally disagree with most of the assertions made about overseers suddenly returning to Ascension levels of BS. They have a lot more interesting counter play and many, many fair cards that can be beaten by many different decks.

The only cards to watch out for in overseers, in my honest opinion, are Box (primarily because the sacullas interaction can get a bit crazy), and Higher Calling (because that card has always been kind of BS).

The other balance outliers I personally see are Counting The Days (puffy stall) and maybe Tinker for Power, which ik many people disagree with. Other than those things, the game is extremely well balanced, and for the better. Like, I'm fine with Shifting Stone + Pacifying Winds being a psuedo mass death, you do have to dump your hand for that to happen, so it's more comparable to a worse overcharged storm. I think time has proven that the Avatars are quite strong, but not a real balancing issue for now, given that there are sooooooooooooooooooo many ways to deal with them, either for a turn to push through for game, or forever via RFG or Transform mechanics.

Offline Interesting_Socks

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #49 on: June 28, 2015, 05:01:06 PM »
You can't have lots of broken cards. That's a concept that doesn't make sense lol.

You can have an unhealthy metagame, which should be any arguments against Avatars, Counting the Days, Box or whatever it is that annoys you.

For the record 3oos was one of the best 3p factions last season. I won the single faction tournament with them and the final was a 3oos mirror match. I used them in ranked to get to the top 10 during the thrall era. They also had one of the best win percentages in the 'top 8' tournament.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2015, 05:05:04 PM by 182jaja182 »

Offline Ragnoraok

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #50 on: June 28, 2015, 06:14:04 PM »
I totally disagree with most of the assertions made about overseers suddenly returning to Ascension levels of BS. They have a lot more interesting counter play and many, many fair cards that can be beaten by many different decks.

The only cards to watch out for in overseers, in my honest opinion, are Box (primarily because the sacullas interaction can get a bit crazy), and Higher Calling (because that card has always been kind of BS).

The other balance outliers I personally see are Counting The Days (puffy stall) and maybe Tinker for Power, which ik many people disagree with. Other than those things, the game is extremely well balanced, and for the better. Like, I'm fine with Shifting Stone + Pacifying Winds being a psuedo mass death, you do have to dump your hand for that to happen, so it's more comparable to a worse overcharged storm. I think time has proven that the Avatars are quite strong, but not a real balancing issue for now, given that there are sooooooooooooooooooo many ways to deal with them, either for a turn to push through for game, or forever via RFG or Transform mechanics.

I heard that before the Champion status was introduced, it was common to have a swarm of +5/5 angels with flying by turn 5. I don't believe that Overseers has reached that level of power, but cards such as Foreunner are not balanced. It is insane for a card to singlehandedly make Overseers much more effective at rushdown than FD; which alone justifies the card being imbalanced. The egregious damage scaling makes it extremely difficult to handle multiple copies of this card, because having at least 2 champions makes it easy to bounce them back and forth; worst of all, there is no way to even kill the champions if they are being sent back to the hand.

Box of Wonders is borderline OP. Melosia is hella unbalanced, and I am surprised noone has made a stink about this card. It effectively makes an aggro or swarm strategy simultaneously effective at morale degradation. Moreover, Equilibrium has the potential to be ridiculous when used in conjunction with that card that makes a 2/2 angel token for every monster the opponent has; an opponent can use the aforementioned token summoner card, then next turn use Equilibrium to effectively clear a troublesome field. This strategy was broken in Hearthstone (Equality + Consecration), and will undoubtedly be abused here later on down the line.

These cards are toxic to the game, because they allow the Overseers faction to encroach upon the specialties of other factions, primarily FD and DoD.

Offline Ragnoraok

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #51 on: June 28, 2015, 06:15:41 PM »
Also, what is the Pacifying Winds and Shifting Stone combo, and how does that lead to a pseudo Mass death scenario.

Offline SwatAK

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #52 on: June 28, 2015, 06:29:36 PM »
Also, what is the Pacifying Winds and Shifting Stone combo, and how does that lead to a pseudo Mass death scenario.
in the best case its 3 characters dead and ur hand is messed up idk how the hell is that anywhere near mass death
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Offline Githian

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #53 on: June 28, 2015, 08:05:52 PM »
I totally disagree with most of the assertions made about overseers suddenly returning to Ascension levels of BS. They have a lot more interesting counter play and many, many fair cards that can be beaten by many different decks.

The only cards to watch out for in overseers, in my honest opinion, are Box (primarily because the sacullas interaction can get a bit crazy), and Higher Calling (because that card has always been kind of BS).

The other balance outliers I personally see are Counting The Days (puffy stall) and maybe Tinker for Power, which ik many people disagree with. Other than those things, the game is extremely well balanced, and for the better. Like, I'm fine with Shifting Stone + Pacifying Winds being a psuedo mass death, you do have to dump your hand for that to happen, so it's more comparable to a worse overcharged storm. I think time has proven that the Avatars are quite strong, but not a real balancing issue for now, given that there are sooooooooooooooooooo many ways to deal with them, either for a turn to push through for game, or forever via RFG or Transform mechanics.

I heard that before the Champion status was introduced, it was common to have a swarm of +5/5 angels with flying by turn 5. I don't believe that Overseers has reached that level of power, but cards such as Foreunner are not balanced. It is insane for a card to singlehandedly make Overseers much more effective at rushdown than FD; which alone justifies the card being imbalanced. The egregious damage scaling makes it extremely difficult to handle multiple copies of this card, because having at least 2 champions makes it easy to bounce them back and forth; worst of all, there is no way to even kill the champions if they are being sent back to the hand.

Box of Wonders is borderline OP. Melosia is hella unbalanced, and I am surprised noone has made a stink about this card. It effectively makes an aggro or swarm strategy simultaneously effective at morale degradation. Moreover, Equilibrium has the potential to be ridiculous when used in conjunction with that card that makes a 2/2 angel token for every monster the opponent has; an opponent can use the aforementioned token summoner card, then next turn use Equilibrium to effectively clear a troublesome field. This strategy was broken in Hearthstone (Equality + Consecration), and will undoubtedly be abused here later on down the line.

These cards are toxic to the game, because they allow the Overseers faction to encroach upon the specialties of other factions, primarily FD and DoD.

I stopped reading when you said Melosia is unbalanced.

The only things I could see getting a change in the current meta are Box (two purity so it's not a card you splash for anymore) and maybe Counting the Days because of the playstyle it promotes.

Offline Ragnoraok

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #54 on: June 28, 2015, 08:11:30 PM »
I totally disagree with most of the assertions made about overseers suddenly returning to Ascension levels of BS. They have a lot more interesting counter play and many, many fair cards that can be beaten by many different decks.

The only cards to watch out for in overseers, in my honest opinion, are Box (primarily because the sacullas interaction can get a bit crazy), and Higher Calling (because that card has always been kind of BS).

The other balance outliers I personally see are Counting The Days (puffy stall) and maybe Tinker for Power, which ik many people disagree with. Other than those things, the game is extremely well balanced, and for the better. Like, I'm fine with Shifting Stone + Pacifying Winds being a psuedo mass death, you do have to dump your hand for that to happen, so it's more comparable to a worse overcharged storm. I think time has proven that the Avatars are quite strong, but not a real balancing issue for now, given that there are sooooooooooooooooooo many ways to deal with them, either for a turn to push through for game, or forever via RFG or Transform mechanics.

I heard that before the Champion status was introduced, it was common to have a swarm of +5/5 angels with flying by turn 5. I don't believe that Overseers has reached that level of power, but cards such as Foreunner are not balanced. It is insane for a card to singlehandedly make Overseers much more effective at rushdown than FD; which alone justifies the card being imbalanced. The egregious damage scaling makes it extremely difficult to handle multiple copies of this card, because having at least 2 champions makes it easy to bounce them back and forth; worst of all, there is no way to even kill the champions if they are being sent back to the hand.

Box of Wonders is borderline OP. Melosia is hella unbalanced, and I am surprised noone has made a stink about this card. It effectively makes an aggro or swarm strategy simultaneously effective at morale degradation. Moreover, Equilibrium has the potential to be ridiculous when used in conjunction with that card that makes a 2/2 angel token for every monster the opponent has; an opponent can use the aforementioned token summoner card, then next turn use Equilibrium to effectively clear a troublesome field. This strategy was broken in Hearthstone (Equality + Consecration), and will undoubtedly be abused here later on down the line.

These cards are toxic to the game, because they allow the Overseers faction to encroach upon the specialties of other factions, primarily FD and DoD.

I stopped reading when you said Melosia is unbalanced.

The only things I could see getting a change in the current meta are Box (two purity so it's not a card you splash for anymore) and maybe Counting the Days because of the playstyle it promotes.

At least hear my justification for Melosia.

Offline Githian

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #55 on: June 28, 2015, 08:18:47 PM »
I totally disagree with most of the assertions made about overseers suddenly returning to Ascension levels of BS. They have a lot more interesting counter play and many, many fair cards that can be beaten by many different decks.

The only cards to watch out for in overseers, in my honest opinion, are Box (primarily because the sacullas interaction can get a bit crazy), and Higher Calling (because that card has always been kind of BS).

The other balance outliers I personally see are Counting The Days (puffy stall) and maybe Tinker for Power, which ik many people disagree with. Other than those things, the game is extremely well balanced, and for the better. Like, I'm fine with Shifting Stone + Pacifying Winds being a psuedo mass death, you do have to dump your hand for that to happen, so it's more comparable to a worse overcharged storm. I think time has proven that the Avatars are quite strong, but not a real balancing issue for now, given that there are sooooooooooooooooooo many ways to deal with them, either for a turn to push through for game, or forever via RFG or Transform mechanics.

I heard that before the Champion status was introduced, it was common to have a swarm of +5/5 angels with flying by turn 5. I don't believe that Overseers has reached that level of power, but cards such as Foreunner are not balanced. It is insane for a card to singlehandedly make Overseers much more effective at rushdown than FD; which alone justifies the card being imbalanced. The egregious damage scaling makes it extremely difficult to handle multiple copies of this card, because having at least 2 champions makes it easy to bounce them back and forth; worst of all, there is no way to even kill the champions if they are being sent back to the hand.

Box of Wonders is borderline OP. Melosia is hella unbalanced, and I am surprised noone has made a stink about this card. It effectively makes an aggro or swarm strategy simultaneously effective at morale degradation. Moreover, Equilibrium has the potential to be ridiculous when used in conjunction with that card that makes a 2/2 angel token for every monster the opponent has; an opponent can use the aforementioned token summoner card, then next turn use Equilibrium to effectively clear a troublesome field. This strategy was broken in Hearthstone (Equality + Consecration), and will undoubtedly be abused here later on down the line.

These cards are toxic to the game, because they allow the Overseers faction to encroach upon the specialties of other factions, primarily FD and DoD.

I stopped reading when you said Melosia is unbalanced.

The only things I could see getting a change in the current meta are Box (two purity so it's not a card you splash for anymore) and maybe Counting the Days because of the playstyle it promotes.

At least hear my justification for Melosia.

I'd love to.

In the meantime, I'll say that I see the problem with Equilibrium+Heaven's Assistance, though I don't like the comparison with the Hearthstone combo since this one take two turns and can be outplayed. If anything, the unbalance comes from Heaven's Assistance, but that's another old story.

Can't really agree with Pacifying Winds+Shifting Stone being a pseudo MD. Maybe a pseudo-Overcharged Storm, and even that is a big stretch.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2015, 08:22:13 PM by Githian »

Offline electro13

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #56 on: June 28, 2015, 08:20:39 PM »
I totally disagree with most of the assertions made about overseers suddenly returning to Ascension levels of BS. They have a lot more interesting counter play and many, many fair cards that can be beaten by many different decks.

The only cards to watch out for in overseers, in my honest opinion, are Box (primarily because the sacullas interaction can get a bit crazy), and Higher Calling (because that card has always been kind of BS).

The other balance outliers I personally see are Counting The Days (puffy stall) and maybe Tinker for Power, which ik many people disagree with. Other than those things, the game is extremely well balanced, and for the better. Like, I'm fine with Shifting Stone + Pacifying Winds being a psuedo mass death, you do have to dump your hand for that to happen, so it's more comparable to a worse overcharged storm. I think time has proven that the Avatars are quite strong, but not a real balancing issue for now, given that there are sooooooooooooooooooo many ways to deal with them, either for a turn to push through for game, or forever via RFG or Transform mechanics.

I heard that before the Champion status was introduced, it was common to have a swarm of +5/5 angels with flying by turn 5. I don't believe that Overseers has reached that level of power, but cards such as Foreunner are not balanced. It is insane for a card to singlehandedly make Overseers much more effective at rushdown than FD; which alone justifies the card being imbalanced. The egregious damage scaling makes it extremely difficult to handle multiple copies of this card, because having at least 2 champions makes it easy to bounce them back and forth; worst of all, there is no way to even kill the champions if they are being sent back to the hand.

Box of Wonders is borderline OP. Melosia is hella unbalanced, and I am surprised noone has made a stink about this card. It effectively makes an aggro or swarm strategy simultaneously effective at morale degradation. Moreover, Equilibrium has the potential to be ridiculous when used in conjunction with that card that makes a 2/2 angel token for every monster the opponent has; an opponent can use the aforementioned token summoner card, then next turn use Equilibrium to effectively clear a troublesome field. This strategy was broken in Hearthstone (Equality + Consecration), and will undoubtedly be abused here later on down the line.

These cards are toxic to the game, because they allow the Overseers faction to encroach upon the specialties of other factions, primarily FD and DoD.

I stopped reading when you said Melosia is unbalanced.

The only things I could see getting a change in the current meta are Box (two purity so it's not a card you splash for anymore) and maybe Counting the Days because of the playstyle it promotes.

+1000000000

Offline Ragnoraok

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #57 on: June 28, 2015, 08:25:03 PM »
A swarm of creatures can attack the fortress while simultaneously reducing the morale of the opponent by the same amount. In an angel deck, this can allow a player another win condition; once the angels are put under control, the opponent will have next to no morale, so at that point, all thats needed is to trade bodies and use spells to kill high morale monsters. Essentially, a player can play an aggro AND morale degradation deck simultaneously. Similarly, a splash of DoD makes this strategy better at reducing morale than a double or triple DoD deck.

Offline Ragnoraok

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #58 on: June 28, 2015, 08:32:07 PM »
In regards to Equilibrium, a player can get rid of troublesome attackers/defenders using the method I described (abusing tokens), then there is nothing around that. Also, an opponent can use Equilibrium, then use Heat Wave or Combustion next turn. Above all, it makes no sense for Overseers to have that card.

Offline Seidlce

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Re: Best set ever?
« Reply #59 on: June 28, 2015, 10:05:14 PM »
If you already have a swarm of creatures to attack (and lower morale) with, why would you need to win based on morale?