Author Topic: Interesting Creature design.  (Read 1961 times)

Offline mrcubez

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Interesting Creature design.
« on: May 30, 2014, 07:42:12 PM »
Hello and good day my name is MrCubez.
I'm fairly intrigued by how this game handle it's creature either going to the graveyard or being bounced from the game.
For instance i would like to know why a creature such as Infected Monk keeps it's " buffed " stats when i dies. Since the way other games like the popular TCG Magic the Gathering or Yugioh does it is that when creature gets removed from the battlefield in anyway they would become a new entity when they return.

This also happens when a card like " Controlled Temporal Anomaly " is used on a creature with the ability Enrage i assume that it is because you regard the creature as the same entity that left the field as the one that gets returned.

Thus what i'm simply asking is why is it designed this way and not the way the other standard TCG's does it since i find i highly intriguing.

So just to clarify i'm looking for a answer as to why the creature entity mecanic as i would refer to them works the way they work i have no interest in how they work i'm interested in why they work the way they do, so what im asking is why was it designed this way i assume it was intentional, and i am just asking out of curiosity since it think it's a interesting view of making a game defy the " norm / standards " set by other TCG's

Offline Vyltyx

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2014, 08:50:12 PM »
This game is good at many things.

The gameplay is deep.

The cards are interesting.

The art is breathtaking.

The lore is massive (or will be, it's got a lot of potential).

The community is seriously like a family.

The devs are active, kind, and true gamers.



I want to say all that, because I don't want to sound mean when I say that the wording and syntax for this game is ABSOLUTELY PUFFYING ATROCIOUS. There are so many inconsistencies that it creates a completely separate game beneath the game, populated by those that know the true effect of misworded cards, and secret interactions that no one could possibly figure out on their own. 
All the forces in the world are not so powerful as an idea whose time has come.

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"You are probably going to end up quoting me in your sig.  Everyone else already has." — WWKnight

Offline Benionin

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2014, 09:23:41 PM »
Before launch, they're hoping to go through all of the cards and standardize the wording.
And, while the wording and effects is terribly inconsistent and sometimes counter-intuitive, please remember that this is a new game in its beta phase. Even MtG is still working on figuring out what the wording of some of their old cards means, and some of the oracle text is pretty crazy. It took MtG years to come up with a standardized template and they're still tweaking it.
So cut these awesome devs some slack. They've made an awesome game, and they're not the first to not check their notes when they write new cards. Let's work together to track down the weird wordings, rulings, and effects and standardize them.
Because even if no one man can figure out the underworld of shady card text, this community, which, as Vyltyx said, is seriously like a family, can.
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Offline Teremus

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2014, 09:01:20 PM »
Let me clarify what you're seeing, perhaps that will allow you to make more sense of it.

Infected Monk doesn't leave the field until he dies the second time. When he dies the first time, he simply "becomes" a zombie version of himself. I know this might sound like he leaves the field at some point, but he doesn't.

Same concept with Infected Devil/Infected Drone/Infected Purifier.

As for the rest of this, it all works the way you'd expect. If it's removed from the field at any point, and unless otherwise stated in the card's text, it is essentially reset. In the case of Enrage, the game is still going on and you won't be able to use Enrage a second time. The game didn't stop at any point, so Enrage was still used, however the card's stats will be reset.

Hope this clarifies things for you.
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Offline Vyltyx

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2014, 10:05:21 PM »
Ascended also works the same way as enrage. Whether it dies and gets awakened, leaves the game, or gets returned to the hand, an angel cannot ascend again.
All the forces in the world are not so powerful as an idea whose time has come.

"NQQbz - It has it all!  Noobz, Boobz and QQ'ing.  I win the internet for today." — ChaosAngel

"You are probably going to end up quoting me in your sig.  Everyone else already has." — WWKnight

Offline DrayGon777

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2014, 10:08:35 PM »
Not even with Cassial? It would be interesting if Cassial could make them ascend again if they lost their ascension the first time, somehow.
Just so you guys know, if you're ever vs WWK, just start putting out random numbers and mathematical symbols, he will surrender.

Offline Vyltyx

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2014, 11:45:33 PM »
Not even with Cassial? It would be interesting if Cassial could make them ascend again if they lost their ascension the first time, somehow.

That's the thing. Once ascended, always ascended, so they never actually lose their ascended status. And someone correct me if I'm wrong, but there are actually two different abilities in play here; ascend and ascended. When ascend is activated, it is removed, and replaced with ascended. So the fact that Cassial activates every character's "ascend" (where applicable), doesn't really mean anything to ascended characters. They don't have their ascend ability anymore, so she doesn't affect them at all.
All the forces in the world are not so powerful as an idea whose time has come.

"NQQbz - It has it all!  Noobz, Boobz and QQ'ing.  I win the internet for today." — ChaosAngel

"You are probably going to end up quoting me in your sig.  Everyone else already has." — WWKnight

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2014, 02:15:44 AM »
Remove from the game effect works like this:
-A creature keeps is base stats. For example, the base stats of an endless horde would be 4/4
-This creature keeps its status effects. For example, an untouchable creature is removed from the game via Temporal Mass Reality Shift will remain untouchable. This means that a creature cannot be enraged twice, even if its stats have been reset. It also means that a unit cannot lose the poisoned status effect.
-Lastly, any passive boosts are applied to the creature's base stats.

Passive boosts are those that come from:

Recurring Nightmare's passive ability
Sleeper of Avarrach's passive ability
Endless Horde's passive ability
Infected Pack Leader's boost
Plaguebearer's boost
Pack leader's boost
Mechanics Overseer's boost
Angel of Virtue's boost
Bromich's and Bromich's banner's boost
Rakarl and Corrupted forest's boost
Conscripted Militia's passive ability
Alpha Demon's passive ability
Best Fiend's passive ability.
Inspiring Soldier's passive ability
Unified Protector's passive ability

wow, simple right?

Offline Vyltyx

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2014, 02:49:38 AM »
wow, simple right?

To you or me, it may be simple, but for those new to the game, this can be kind of confusing. It's always better to be understanding in these situations.

It's also not obvious that status effects stay on a character even when removed from a game. It's not stated in any tutorial, and I don't think it's in the rulebook (correct me if I'm wrong).
All the forces in the world are not so powerful as an idea whose time has come.

"NQQbz - It has it all!  Noobz, Boobz and QQ'ing.  I win the internet for today." — ChaosAngel

"You are probably going to end up quoting me in your sig.  Everyone else already has." — WWKnight

Offline DrayGon777

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #9 on: June 25, 2014, 10:03:20 PM »
The rulebook is kinda outdated, to be honest. Really needs an update. Perhaps we, as a community, could work on an update, but it'd be better (and easier) if everything had more consistent wording. Otherwise, we'd have to add in exceptions all over the place. :(
Just so you guys know, if you're ever vs WWK, just start putting out random numbers and mathematical symbols, he will surrender.

Offline Teremus

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #10 on: June 26, 2014, 04:44:15 AM »
The rulebook is kinda outdated, to be honest. Really needs an update. Perhaps we, as a community, could work on an update, but it'd be better (and easier) if everything had more consistent wording. Otherwise, we'd have to add in exceptions all over the place. :(

No worries, the great and glorious Poga is already working on it.
No seriously, I really like cheese.

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Offline Poga

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #11 on: June 26, 2014, 04:51:20 AM »
Hi guys,

We have plans to go over old cards with a fresh coat of more consistent wording, as well as an updated rule book. Stay tuned, we'll have it out as soon as we can.
James.. I make this game.

Offline Benionin

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Re: Interesting Creature design.
« Reply #12 on: June 26, 2014, 05:39:43 AM »
I just started a thread to hunt down/standardize weird card wordings here:
http://forum.lightmare.com.au/index.php?topic=61676.msg109483#msg109483
I may not be staff, but I'd like to help. And with the whole community working on hunting down this stuff, it'll get done that much faster and more thoroughly!
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