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Infinity Wars => News and Developer Talk => Topic started by: ES [BoD] on September 11, 2016, 05:22:29 PM

Title: The New Balance Team
Post by: ES [BoD] on September 11, 2016, 05:22:29 PM
Hey guys, ES here, as you know I became a CM (Community Moderator) recently, the reason behind this new found role is simply because I think that this game isn't beyond saving at it's current state so I intend to pitch in and improve it, with the help from both the moderators and the community.

So I though that I should share the following with the community:

My first project is a bit ambitious but i'm sure it's doable: A Balance team.

The team consists of some of the best IW players: Myself, largenuggets, InvertedEye, KeyRanAway, Adorabear, Hacker, Dogeee (also serves as the team's mascot  :P) and others which requested to remain anonymous  ;D Thanks Guys!

The primary function of our team will be to oversee and rebalance the release of the remaining waves as well as the previous waves that have been released.

Another goal i have is to rebalance all the cards in the game from previous sets.
Currently ingame there are a large sum of "unplayable"cards, what i mean by that is either their cost/stat ratio is too low (Masked initiate,airbourne scientist, Candit's thrall,waste chucker etc.) or their ability is lacking in some way (Ultra Unit, honorable farewell, honor hill the list goes one.), and the result is that they hardly ever see play.

These cards don't have to be in the meta to be playable, in some cases, the slightest change in stats will be enough to keep players interested in the card, making a variety of new and unique decks, in other cases a whole overhaul is required.

Draft got a bit better with the slight changes that myself and Hacker have implemented, no more 3soa op decks (while still playable from what i've seen).
Still it's not perfect and one of the balance tasks will be to carefully balance draft until we get the desirable result making all factions playable.

We will work on that as soon as we are done with the current set. :D


Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Grinnin_Gin on September 11, 2016, 06:30:39 PM
It's at once good to see Lightmare and Yodo take the job of balancing a bit more seriously by adding a re-balancing team, at the same time it's also a bit disturbing to see few of the old Council members returning to this new team, especially considering the fact that many of them are still active in the forums and discord chat, but were not invited to sit on this new team.

It's also especially disturbing considering it was many of the old Council members who made the initial push to get such a team re-instated in the game before the hiring of Community Moderators, or even before the hiring of DrewUniverse.

I wish this new team the best, of course. But the old blood of the Council seems to be running a bit thin, to say the least.

Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Adorabear on September 11, 2016, 06:37:53 PM
Dont worry Gin ill do my best to whip them into shape. They seem to be doing good so far.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: MerliniX on September 11, 2016, 06:53:43 PM
especially considering the fact that many of them are still active in the forums and discord chat, but were not invited to sit on this new team.

Many of them were invited. I know that they reached out to me, but I turned them down for now. If they can get some good stuff done, and the game gets into a better state, I might be interested in the future, but for me, personally, as of right now I am not interested.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: ORISOLVE on September 11, 2016, 09:09:35 PM
ES, do you even edit your post? So many typos and errors. Grammar is off too, but that's forgiven.  ;D
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: ES [BoD] on September 11, 2016, 11:03:14 PM
ES, do you even edit your post? So many typos and errors. Grammar is off too, but that's forgiven.  ;D
haha sorry man, I was really tired when i wrote it.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Pelagoth on September 12, 2016, 06:18:44 AM
Sounds like progress is being made afterall. Seeing ES on the balance-team puts me at ease (see what I did there?). I hope that my op alt-account 3p SoA draft is gonna be okay/mediocre soon (I really do).

Hint for Balance team: Legionnaire of Dawn. Make it playable atleast. *cough* I'd love a pure FD 3-cost charge minion *cough*

Now if only they could form a proper marketing team, then I'd probably even return. ::)
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Dogeee [BoD] on September 12, 2016, 02:08:54 PM
Sounds like progress is being made afterall. Seeing ES on the balance-team puts me at ease (see what I did there?). I hope that my op alt-account 3p SoA draft is gonna be okay/mediocre soon (I really do).

Hint for Balance team: Legionnaire of Dawn. Make it playable atleast. *cough* I'd love a pure FD 3-cost charge minion *cough*

Now if only they could form a proper marketing team, then I'd probably even return. ::)

i am pretty optimistic es will make sure that aberion will be moved to 3 cost and given charge immediately  8)
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Weak_Wolf on September 12, 2016, 04:29:20 PM
I am a huge advocate for rebalancing older cards and it is something I have championed for a very long time. I only play Exile, Sleepers and Flame Dawn decks and liken myself to know a bit about each faction. If you guys are taking suggestions I would be more than happy to pitch a few card changes. Being the over analytical douche that I am I will go over the cards I believe to be a problem in some of my main factions. I broke this into 2 sections, cards I think are weak but dont know how to buff them and cards that I know the perfect solution to their problem.

EXILES

I Dont know what to change, but a change needs to be made

Waste Chucker - Allow you to chose which card you discard, similar to yagrons ability. For all that is holy, just allow it to chose which card you discard, I am begging you.

Hells Gambler - Bad flip should make you discard a card next turn, once again similar to yagron. That or make him lose 2/2 instead of 4/4.

Two Face - Replace the switching sides with something else, anything else, make me discard a card, Cost me an additional resource when it dies, ANYTHING ELSE!

Wheezer of Smog - Increase stats or reduce cost to 1.

Scramble - Idk

Reckless Abandon -  Currently bugged now so it pretty much always discards itself... then you end up playing it NEXT turn for 0 cost. So essentially you do not get its effect until 2 turns later.


I know exactly what this card needs, please listen!

Nysrugh the Insatiable - NEEDS CONSUME, Consume 1 or Consume 2, he NEEDS this.

Volatile Genome -  This card is the perfect example of knowing the difference between potential damage and actual damage. Potentially it can do A LOT of damage, but in actuality it rarely does and you get more use out of Winds of War. There are a certain key scenarios where this card would be a little bit better than Winds of War for its cost. And in every other scenario Winds of War is far superior. I think this card really needs to be a 4 cost. I would plead for a 3 cost with a reduction to 4 damage instead of 5. I think at this card would be healthy.

Demon Wastes - You essentially pay 2 to be able to pay 2 and use demonize whenever you want throughout the game. The only problem is it doesn't have the same flexibility as demonize as it cannot buff your own characters and there is a risk involved if you may randomly get a 1-3 cost card and you end up losing out on the cost. A price change would fix this easily. I think reducing the active cost to 1 would be great! :), but that may be a little too cost effective. Instead I say reduce its play cost to 1.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: MerliniX on September 12, 2016, 05:11:53 PM
I am a huge advocate for rebalancing older cards and it is something I have championed for a very long time. I only play Exile, Sleepers and Flame Dawn decks and liken myself to know a bit about each faction. If you guys are taking suggestions I would be more than happy to pitch a few card changes. Being the over analytical douche that I am I will go over the cards I believe to be a problem in some of my main factions. I broke this into 2 sections, cards I think are weak but dont know how to buff them and cards that I know the perfect solution to their problem.

EXILES

I Dont know what to change, but a change needs to be made

Waste Chucker - Allow you to chose which card you discard, similar to yagrons ability. For all that is holy, just allow it to chose which card you discard, I am begging you.

Hells Gambler - Bad flip should make you discard a card next turn, once again similar to yagron. That or make him lose 2/2 instead of 4/4.

Two Face - Replace the switching sides with something else, anything else, make me discard a card, Cost me an additional resource when it dies, ANYTHING ELSE!

Wheezer of Smog - Increase stats or reduce cost to 1.

Scramble - Idk

Reckless Abandon -  Currently bugged now so it pretty much always discards itself... then you end up playing it NEXT turn for 0 cost. So essentially you do not get its effect until 2 turns later.


I know exactly what this card needs, please listen!

Nysrugh the Insatiable - NEEDS CONSUME, Consume 1 or Consume 2, he NEEDS this.

Volatile Genome -  This card is the perfect example of knowing the difference between potential damage and actual damage. Potentially it can do A LOT of damage, but in actuality it rarely does and you get more use out of Winds of War. There are a certain key scenarios where this card would be a little bit better than Winds of War for its cost. And in every other scenario Winds of War is far superior. I think this card really needs to be a 4 cost. I would plead for a 3 cost with a reduction to 4 damage instead of 5. I think at this card would be healthy.

Demon Wastes - You essentially pay 2 to be able to pay 2 and use demonize whenever you want throughout the game. The only problem is it doesn't have the same flexibility as demonize as it cannot buff your own characters and there is a risk involved if you may randomly get a 1-3 cost card and you end up losing out on the cost. A price change would fix this easily. I think reducing the active cost to 1 would be great! :), but that may be a little too cost effective. Instead I say reduce its play cost to 1.

No changes until prizes are given out. http://forum.lightmare.com.au/index.php?topic=65552.0
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Weak_Wolf on September 12, 2016, 05:28:26 PM

No changes until prizes are given out. http://forum.lightmare.com.au/index.php?topic=65552.0

I never paid those out? I thought I did... Sorry if I didnt? I took a break from the game around that time, I thought I handled that before I left.

I just finished moving across the state and I dont have a lot of free cash right now. If you guys could give me a week or two (Around the 25th) I will pay the prize pool x2.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Number11 on September 12, 2016, 09:04:04 PM
I am a huge advocate for rebalancing older cards and it is something I have championed for a very long time. I only play Exile, Sleepers and Flame Dawn decks and liken myself to know a bit about each faction. If you guys are taking suggestions I would be more than happy to pitch a few card changes. Being the over analytical douche that I am I will go over the cards I believe to be a problem in some of my main factions. I broke this into 2 sections, cards I think are weak but dont know how to buff them and cards that I know the perfect solution to their problem.

EXILES

I Dont know what to change, but a change needs to be made

Waste Chucker - Allow you to chose which card you discard, similar to yagrons ability. For all that is holy, just allow it to chose which card you discard, I am begging you.

Hells Gambler - Bad flip should make you discard a card next turn, once again similar to yagron. That or make him lose 2/2 instead of 4/4.

Two Face - Replace the switching sides with something else, anything else, make me discard a card, Cost me an additional resource when it dies, ANYTHING ELSE!

Wheezer of Smog - Increase stats or reduce cost to 1.

Scramble - Idk

Reckless Abandon -  Currently bugged now so it pretty much always discards itself... then you end up playing it NEXT turn for 0 cost. So essentially you do not get its effect until 2 turns later.


I know exactly what this card needs, please listen!

Nysrugh the Insatiable - NEEDS CONSUME, Consume 1 or Consume 2, he NEEDS this.

Volatile Genome -  This card is the perfect example of knowing the difference between potential damage and actual damage. Potentially it can do A LOT of damage, but in actuality it rarely does and you get more use out of Winds of War. There are a certain key scenarios where this card would be a little bit better than Winds of War for its cost. And in every other scenario Winds of War is far superior. I think this card really needs to be a 4 cost. I would plead for a 3 cost with a reduction to 4 damage instead of 5. I think at this card would be healthy.

Demon Wastes - You essentially pay 2 to be able to pay 2 and use demonize whenever you want throughout the game. The only problem is it doesn't have the same flexibility as demonize as it cannot buff your own characters and there is a risk involved if you may randomly get a 1-3 cost card and you end up losing out on the cost. A price change would fix this easily. I think reducing the active cost to 1 would be great! :), but that may be a little too cost effective. Instead I say reduce its play cost to 1.

Waste Chucker: good suggestion.

Hells Gambler: I once thought of a card, a demon character that likes to pick on the weak and will gain a stat buff if a different character gets a stat debuff. That way you can make up for a bad gamble with Hells Gambler and the demon character would also benefit from Mark of The Demon and Demon Wastes. But if the negative outcome of the gamble with Hells Gambler should be changed then I would say that it should be a random discard instead of a selected discard, otherwise it would not be much of a gamble for a zero cost effect.

Two Face: My suggestion would be to limit the time of how long the opponent keeps Two Face after killing it. They could add a text that says "X turns after Two Face switches sides, Two Face is sacrificed". Given how great the starting stats are for the cost of the card, the card should have a big negative effect. I would say that a discard would not be enough of a negative effect. As for having the card cost additional resources if killed, I would say it should then at minimum cost the player additional 2 resources.

Wheezer of Smog: So satisfying to counter a Descension with Smog. I would say that he should not cost less as the effect of the card can be very good when used right. If given a buff it should rather be for his stats, but not too much as his effect can be very strong at times and for such a good effect the stats should be under the curve for his cost.

Scramble: Just put the card at 0 for its normal cost and add to it that the player also draws a card.

Reckless Abandon: The card would be fine if they added to it to only discard cards other than Reckless Abandon.

Nysrugh the Insatiable: Have not formed an opinion on the card yet.

Volatile Genome: Lowering the cost could work or the card could be changed to also target the support zone.

Demon Wastes: The use of Demonize is not correct as you were trying to make comparisons to Mark of The Demon. I would say having the location cost 1 resource would be fine.


There is one card I'm going to mention now that I believe needs a little change. Evellee, Mage Guild Recruiter should not recruit a unique character that is already in play. Some card are balanced by using the Unique keyword and Evellee will just continuously ignore that. There are other ways to get multiple of the same unique character, but those cards can't do that nearly as easily as Evellee does. This way decks that don't have the removal to get rid of Evellee will have to face up against ridiculous decks that make use of some unique characters that were supposed to be balanced by their Unique keyword. And this is also going to effect future cards that use the Unique keyword. So I hope this is something that will eventually get changed.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Hiding on September 13, 2016, 04:13:24 AM
For wheezer id say increase his cost and make everything untouchable.

Demon wastes should be discard a random card, target gains minus resource cost. The reason exiles is a thing is because people are being exiled into a desert lorewise. Why is demon wastes not a discard effect?

Hells gambler should have a gamble effect related to some decision making. Maybe discard a random card, if it is a even numbered card resource cost he gains +3/+3, if odd numbered gains -3/-3. So if your hand is mainly 2 drops then you can make the decision to flip it. Or reverse it so if your hand is mainly odd numbered +3/+3 to synergize with gather disciples and the unlimited exiles cards. Another idea is make it +2/+2 if the card discarded has exile. -2/-2 if the discarded card doesnt.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Number11 on September 13, 2016, 02:13:43 PM
For wheezer id say increase his cost and make everything untouchable.

Demon wastes should be discard a random card, target gains minus resource cost. The reason exiles is a thing is because people are being exiled into a desert lorewise. Why is demon wastes not a discard effect?

Hells gambler should have a gamble effect related to some decision making. Maybe discard a random card, if it is a even numbered card resource cost he gains +3/+3, if odd numbered gains -3/-3. So if your hand is mainly 2 drops then you can make the decision to flip it. Or reverse it so if your hand is mainly odd numbered +3/+3 to synergize with gather disciples and the unlimited exiles cards. Another idea is make it +2/+2 if the card discarded has exile. -2/-2 if the discarded card doesnt.

I had thought about what if they made a new card with wheezer where he will stop the opponent from targeting your own cards with spells and abilities the turn he is deployed.

I do agree that having Demon wastes discard a card would makes sense.

I do find your ideas with Hells gambler intresting and I think it would be fun to play with him like that.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: avc145 on September 13, 2016, 10:11:09 PM
Ok, I am far away to be some expert or anything similar, but here my 2 cents about balance changes:


                                                               WARPATH


Defiant Hunter -> Make it 6/6

Docile Panda -. Make it 5/16

Granthar -> Make it kill character in command too.

Rabbid Rabbit -> Make it transform in a 4/4 Bloodthirst 2 Beat Zombie.

Ancient Agression Emblem -> Increase the deploy cost and the ability cost 3, but make it being able to target your own characters


                                                      GENESIS INDUSTRIES


Cottontail -> Reduce the ability cost to 2, if it this make him too cost effective change his stats to 20/20 and cost to 10, this way he will be a late game card and this mitigate the cost efficience agains rush and agro.

Genesis Spy-> Increse the number of "Misinformation" placed on the deck to 4, or maybe 5 at max, but make it has the followoing effect "Pay 4, draw a card".

Kinectly Overload Drone -> make it 1/1 OR reduce its cost to 0.

Mechanics Overseer-> Increase the cost to 5, reduce the stats to 5/5, but make the buff +2/+2

Angelify -> Increase the buff to +5/+5 or reduce the cost to 4.

Tinker -> Make it triple purit, but increase the buff to +2/+2

Dragon Project-> Make it has the following effect "Pay X, exaust, for each 1 resource spent, Dragon project becomes 10% complete, when it is 100% complete, it creates a 30/30 Flying Unstopabble machine Dragon.  If the card would become too strong you can reduce the dragonĀ“s stats to 20/20.

Orion Grave -> Make the reduce cost buff being able to play characters with 0 cost.

Imolation Drone -> Reduce the cost to 2, make it 1/1 with Flying and Imolate and keep the 1 damage effect.


                                                               
                                                                     VERORE


Aleta Imortal Sorceres -> Reduce teh ability cost to 3.

Apparition -> Reduce the cost to 5.

Brute Spawn -> Reduce the stats to 1/1, increase the cost to 5 and make the bonus be +1/+1

Groteske brute -> Make it only be forbiden to block if the ability was activated and reduce the ability cost to 3, or 4 at max.

Verore Death Workship -> Increase the initial stats to 3/3.

Veorian hidra -> Make the buff be +1/+2.

Death Blast -> Dont remove any character from the graveyard, but for each CARD in your graveyard deal 1 damage to your opponent fortress.

Heat Wave -> Increase the damage to 3.


                                                           
                                                                 FLAME DAWN


Aberion, The hammer of Dawn-> make he cost X and its stats be X/X

Duelist -> Make it 5/4, or 4/4 at least.

Frontline Warrior -> Make the buff be +1/+1. If this makes it be too strong change the buff to only activated while deployed to while is ob the battlefield or the Defese Zone

Kali Ascended -> make it 10/10.

klore -> Reduce the initial stats to 1/1.

Mark 1 Brimstone Battletank -> Reduce the ability cost to 4. if this is too strong make the ability only be playable while deployed.

Tithe Collector-> Reduce the status to 0/1 and the cost to 3.

Vicious Ranseker -> make it 6/6

BloodBath -> Reduce the cost to 5.

Call the Cruze -> Remove the assault zone lock, reduce the cost to 3, but create three 3/3 characters, if this would make the card too strong, still reduce the cost to 3 and remove the lock, but create three 1/1 characters.

Exaust -> Reduce the cost to 2.

Bromich banner -> Reduce the cost to 3.

Brimstone -> Reduce the cost to 2.



                                                   DESCENDENTS OF THE DRAGONS


Chef -> Increase the cost to 3, but make it buff itself.

Avatar of Lingao-> Attack a enemy fortreess deal damage as morale AND as health. If he becomes too strong reduce the stats to 12/12 or even 10/10.

Echo of the Batlefield -> Increase the stats to 7/7, or at least 6/6.

Soldier of the Wall -> Make it 6/7.

Disarm -> increase the csot to 3, or even 4, but make the effect be forever.

Humble -> Dont heal the enemy character when used, damage will not count as a "debuff".

Jinhai Ambush -> Reduce teh csot to 3, if this would make the card to effective just make it create three 1/1 characters.

Suprise Deffense -> Increase the cost to 5, and would die, instead it goes to the support zone and be exausted for 3 turns.

Heavens Bell -> Make you be able to choose the position of the card in the Defense Zone.

Shift Stone-> Increase the csot to 3, or even 4, but the effect lasts forever.

Counting the Days-> Make a complete rework, I suggest making it Triple Purit the following effect "On the first turn if Counting the Days is on your hand or deck its automatically played for free, at the end of each turn its become 4% more complete, at the end of teh turn, if Counting The Days is 100% complete, you win the game"


                                                   
                                                        SLEEPERS OF AVARRACH


Cyber Infested Dragon -> Increase its stats to 20/20, but remove the Endless Hord effect and the auto exile effect. Add teh folowwing effect "If Cyber Infested Dragon comes to the battlefield from the graveyard its stats are 15/15 (or 12/12)"

Zombie Scavengeer -> Reduce its stats to 1/1.

Overwhelming Dead -> Increase the cost to 5.

Endless Horde -. increase its stats to 6/6.

Undeath Wish -> Make you be able to ressurect a enemy character too.


                                                         
                                                                EXILES


Demonborn -> Makes its initial status 1/1, but remove his ability and give him Flyingas a passive OR Remove his abiliyy, give him Flying as a passive, increase the stats to 5/5 and the cost to 3.

Demon Gambler -> Reworkteh card, make the initial status 4/4 and give it the folowing effect "Demon Gambler enters the field with one "Coin Counter", while he has a "Coin Counter" he receives a +3/+3 buff (initial stats + coin buff= 7/7 character). Remove a "Coin Counter", Demon Gambler has 50% of chance to reveive a adittional +3/+3 buff and 50% of chance to receive a -3/-3 debuff (initial stats + the loss of the passive coin buff + the loss of the gamble= 1/1 character).

Gravedredge Demon -. Make it 12/12 and reduce the cost to 5.

Hungry Devil -> make it 9/9.

Infected Devil -> make it 7/7

Gatherer the Weak-> Increase the cost to 3, give it exile 0.

Demonize -> Remove the "Consume 2" effect.



                                                           OVERSEERS


Rework the "Champion Rule" to make you be able to have any number of champions deployed, but only ONE COPY of each champion on your deck.




                                                                   FACTIONLESS


Gathering Thoughts-. Remove the auto exile effect.

The Calamity -> I have two suggestions for this polemic card 1) Make it only activated at the end of the turn its played, in other word, a soft nerf.  2) Reduce the cost to 10, but you can only have ONE Calamity in you deck and Calamity auto exile after used, in other words it becomes a one use per game card, no more recicles Calamities, this will be a total rework.





Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Pelagoth on September 14, 2016, 06:16:25 AM
MAKE DRAGONS GREAT AGAIN!
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: zekses on September 14, 2016, 10:25:45 AM
Ok, I am far away to be some expert or anything similar, but here my 2 cents about balance changes:

These balance changes will break the game. You don't consider how any of these will affect certain abilities or combinations at all only looking at the card alone.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: JLazeZ on September 14, 2016, 10:42:22 AM
Ok, I am far away to be some expert or anything similar, but here my 2 cents about balance changes:

These balance changes will break the game. You don't consider how any of these will affect certain abilities or combinations at all only looking at the card alone.

But look at that Surprise Defence buff though. I can make ANYTHING into a mini-avatar!  :P

@Avc I do like how you're giving suggestions though! We can always use more stuff from the community  ;D
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: avc145 on September 14, 2016, 04:51:04 PM
Just to be clear, that effect buff on Surprise Defense would only happens once, if you play the character using Suprise Defense and he remains alive at the end of the turn, he comes back to your deck. If he dies, instead of going to graveyard he becomes exaust for 3 turns, remaining on the battlefield, but if he dies again he goes to graveyard normally. The exaust for three effect only prevents death one time.

Aboutut how those changes would break the game, right know the game is "balanced" because 70% of the cards are completly useless trash (yes, the 70% percetage is a pun with Calamities Posts, but most of the cards are indeed pretty bad and useless). With these changes the game would be balanced not because almost anything is weak and underpowered, but because most of things are usefull and strong, this would make decisions about what to put and what to remove from deck making more significant.

Right now each faction has only 1 or 2 really cost effective cards per card cost (ie: 1 really good 5 cost card that pretty makes every other 5 cost card dispensable), making everything usefull in some way would force the players to giveaway some card with strong power to focus on other powerfull card which have the same cost but have more sinergy with the rest of the deck.

If everything is OP nothing is OP. If everything is UP, 2 or 3 cards on each faction sustain the burden of the entire faction on their backs.

The majority of useless trash card can became great and playable cards simply reducing their 1 resource on their cost or giving a +1/+1 buff.

Maybe some of the changes that I am suggesting was too much, but right know the game has lots of stronger almost cheater cards wihch have a colossal cost efficience and the games is still playable, not optimal playable but with some balance.

These changes will mostly correct problems with some specially underpowered factions that lack high cost eficcient cards and only relies on a few OP cards (i.e. DOD), at the same time other factions are extremely meta dominant because they have some of the best cost efficient cards on the game (i.e. Flame Dawn and G.I., almost every meta deck I see use one of those two factions as a core).
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: JLazeZ on September 14, 2016, 07:31:57 PM
@avc Umm there are actually 2 DoD cards with similar abilities. Resolve of the Dragon and Prayer of the Dragon. Plus with your version of Surprise Defence I'll be able to summon ANY Character for only 5 cost as long as they die right? Seems OP since I can use it on Ao Shun or the Avatars turn 5.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: avc145 on September 14, 2016, 08:40:44 PM
@avc Umm there are actually 2 DoD cards with similar abilities. Resolve of the Dragon and Prayer of the Dragon. Plus with your version of Surprise Defence I'll be able to summon ANY Character for only 5 cost as long as they die right? Seems OP since I can use it on Ao Shun or the Avatars turn 5.

Sleepers have 3 cards with ressurect effect, the only difference between them is the purity and the rarity, being the epic triple purity the strongest card, I dont see a problem on DOD having similar cards with different rarities and buffed up effects .

If you use Surprise Defense on a Avatar you will pay 5 resources and they will remains exausted for 3 turns, its not OP, since you can play them paying their normal cost on turn 7. You will have a 2 resource discount, but the opponet wil have 3 turns knowing that you will have a Avatar.

About Ao Shun, we can make him a exception, because normally he never dies, since his inate passive would make him become exausted instead of dying.  On the end of the turn Surprise Defense would consider him alive, so he will have to be puted back to his owner deck.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: JLazeZ on September 14, 2016, 09:05:12 PM
@avc Umm there are actually 2 DoD cards with similar abilities. Resolve of the Dragon and Prayer of the Dragon. Plus with your version of Surprise Defence I'll be able to summon ANY Character for only 5 cost as long as they die right? Seems OP since I can use it on Ao Shun or the Avatars turn 5.

Sleepers have 3 cards with ressurect effect, the only difference between them is the purity and the rarity, being the epic triple purity the strongest card, I dont see a problem on DOD having similar cards with different rarities and buffed up effects .

If you use Surprise Defense on a Avatar you will pay 5 resources and they will remains exausted for 3 turns, its not OP, since you can play them paying their normal cost on turn 7. You will have a 2 resource discount, but the opponet wil have 3 turns knowing that you will have a Avatar.

About Ao Shun, we can make him a exception, because normally he never dies, since his inate passive would make him become exausted instead of dying.  On the end of the turn Surprise Defense would consider him alive, so he will have to be puted back to his owner deck.

Yeah I guess I was overestimating how strong it'd be. Though you can use heaven's bell or vigil to move them into the defence zone even if they are exhausted fyi. Not sure if you knew that or not.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: The_Fallen on September 17, 2016, 10:05:52 PM
Well after reading the first posts here are my two cents.
A balance team is nice, but with the opening post made by es, I think the necessary changes to fd will never come. Then again the old council didn't really shine with wise balance decisions. To be honest, no one knows what happend behind the scenes, but the cards that were released in that time period speak for themselves.

So it can't get worse, but the possibility of improvement are a snowball's chance in hell.

Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: ES [BoD] on September 17, 2016, 11:51:42 PM
Well after reading the first posts here are my two cents.
A balance team is nice, but with the opening post made by es, I think the necessary changes to fd will never come. Then again the old council didn't really shine with wise balance decisions. To be honest, no one knows what happend behind the scenes, but the cards that were released in that time period speak for themselves.

So it can't get worse, but the possibility of improvement are a snowball's chance in hell.
You seem really frustrated with how things are atm and with the old council, that's understandable yet it does not give you the right to discredit me and my team before we even produced a single change.

Flame Dawn is underrated in the current meta (only 1 deck is considered T1 and only involves 1p FD purity - 2gi/fd mechborn which me and nuggets came up with right after the Mechborn change) it is thanks to this singular change that this deck has a place in the meta.
Death blast and feartrops are probably both T2.
You will probably not see any other top player playing a fd deck to get to the top of ranked for example, infact most vets find flame dawn to be unreliable.

Flame Dawn is really weak atm compare to other factions and will lose quickly to mill,tinkerside, valuebots,yagron 2ex/cov and other meta decks unless it is backed heavily by other factions like cov/gi etc.

Personally I play only 1 deck that involves flame dawn out of 9 others.

Lastly, I may be the founder of this balance team but don't call the shots, every member gets an equal voice and we will only "clear" a card if everyone agrees on it, otherwise we brainstorm and figure out a better solution.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: largenuggets [BoD] on September 17, 2016, 11:56:16 PM
Well after reading the first posts here are my two cents.
A balance team is nice, but with the opening post made by es, I think the necessary changes to fd will never come. Then again the old council didn't really shine with wise balance decisions. To be honest, no one knows what happend behind the scenes, but the cards that were released in that time period speak for themselves.

So it can't get worse, but the possibility of improvement are a snowball's chance in hell.
You seem really frustrated with how things atm are and with the old council, that's understandable yet it does not give you the right to discredit me and my team before we even produced a single change.

Flame Dawn is underrated in the current meta (only 1 deck is considered T1 and only involves 1p FD purity - 2gi/fd mechborn which me and nuggets came up with right after the Mechborn change) it is thanks to this singular change that this deck has a place in the meta.
Death blast and feartrops are probably both T2.
You will probably not see any other top player playing a fd deck to get to the top of ranked for example, infact most vets find flame dawn to be unreliable.

Flame Dawn is really weak atm compare to other factions and will lose quickly to mill,tinkerside, valuebots,yagron 2ex/cov and other meta decks unless it is backed heavily by other factions like cov/gi etc.

Personally I play only 1 deck that involves flame dawn out of 9 others.

Lastly, I may be the founder of this balance team but don't call the shots, every member gets an equal voice and we will only "clear" a card if everyone agrees on it, otherwise we brainstorm and figure out a better solution.

+1 to everything ES said, mechborn is also the only fd deck I play right now and am very experienced with all the other factions from playng and creating numerous other decks for myself. On top of that the other people on the team play a wide variety of factions and decks so I can assure you that no particular faction will get favored or unfavored when it comes to balance.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Hiding on September 18, 2016, 05:31:28 AM
It would be cool for fd or another faction that gets a card like "target character on the battlefield cant block". Maybe have it cost like 3.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: zekses on September 18, 2016, 12:35:58 PM
It would be cool for fd or another faction that gets a card like "target character on the battlefield cant block". Maybe have it cost like 3.

It's called Exhaust XD Unless you mean a permanent debuff
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: InvertedEye on September 18, 2016, 12:36:27 PM
Do people really think that players join the balance team to buff their favorite factions? Trust me guys most of our work involves trying to stop cards that will ruin the game from going live. ::)   
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: JLazeZ on September 18, 2016, 04:08:15 PM
Do people really think that players join the balance team to buff their favorite factions? Trust me guys most of our work involves trying to stop cards that will ruin the game from going live. ::)

No no you got it backwards man. If you release enough broken cards then they'll balance each other and no cards will be broken.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: sogeking on September 18, 2016, 07:47:53 PM
others which requested to remain anonymous=> drevoed (%90 sure) and sakuyana or mew ?To be honest all of council members really well players but it will fail if u dont push developers really hardly.i mean at some point you will have to fight with devs.They will try to ignore you or will develope really slowly.

Infact , devs r giving signals about how they are actually lazy.For example it is too easy to buff unusable cards simply by changing their costs or redesigning a little bit but instead they r not doing this immediately and delaying it until rebellion fully out.it will only take two days but no wait until rebellion out lol.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: avc145 on September 18, 2016, 08:55:43 PM
Do people really think that players join the balance team to buff their favorite factions? Trust me guys most of our work involves trying to stop cards that will ruin the game from going live. ::)

No no you got it backwards man. If you release enough broken cards then they'll balance each other and no cards will be broken.

Magic The Gathering works pretty much like this
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: ecliptix on September 25, 2016, 07:12:48 AM


EXILES

Wheezer of Smog - Increase stats or reduce cost to 1.


As is, wheezer wins games. Just ask Nuggets :D

Angelify? Nope
Descension? Nope
Upgrade? Nope (Gains you value if it results in a bad block)
Mechborning? Nope
Tinkers? Nope
Siphoners? Double Nope
Shikana Charge? Nope

I'm sure I'm missing more here but those are the big ones that come to mind. Especially that whole "I can block siphoners" thing. That's kinda a big deal.

Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Weak_Wolf on September 25, 2016, 07:52:55 AM


EXILES

Wheezer of Smog - Increase stats or reduce cost to 1.


As is, wheezer wins games. Just ask Nuggets :D

Angelify? Nope
Descension? Nope
Upgrade? Nope (Gains you value if it results in a bad block)
Mechborning? Nope
Tinkers? Nope
Siphoners? Double Nope
Shikana Charge? Nope

I'm sure I'm missing more here but those are the big ones that come to mind. Especially that whole "I can block siphoners" thing. That's kinda a big deal.

Sure its ok in a few situations, but its terrible in ALL other situations. Not to mention that most of the things you mention it counters cost the same as it does, at that point why not just run denial and remove all of the guesswork of trying to predict when your opponent will play descension.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: InvertedEye on September 25, 2016, 08:39:03 AM


EXILES

Wheezer of Smog - Increase stats or reduce cost to 1.


As is, wheezer wins games. Just ask Nuggets :D

Angelify? Nope
Descension? Nope
Upgrade? Nope (Gains you value if it results in a bad block)
Mechborning? Nope
Tinkers? Nope
Siphoners? Double Nope
Shikana Charge? Nope

I'm sure I'm missing more here but those are the big ones that come to mind. Especially that whole "I can block siphoners" thing. That's kinda a big deal.

It won't stop mechborn and herald+shikana charge because they don't target. Wheezer is also overshadowed by a certain new factionless card. It could do with a small buff really considering there are other cards with more powerful deploy abilities that have a far better cost to stat ratio.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Hiding on September 25, 2016, 11:47:46 AM


EXILES

Wheezer of Smog - Increase stats or reduce cost to 1.


As is, wheezer wins games. Just ask Nuggets :D

Angelify? Nope
Descension? Nope
Upgrade? Nope (Gains you value if it results in a bad block)
Mechborning? Nope
Tinkers? Nope
Siphoners? Double Nope
Shikana Charge? Nope

I'm sure I'm missing more here but those are the big ones that come to mind. Especially that whole "I can block siphoners" thing. That's kinda a big deal.

It won't stop mechborn and herald+shikana charge because they don't target. Wheezer is also overshadowed by a certain new factionless card. It could do with a small buff really considering there are other cards with more powerful deploy abilities that have a far better cost to stat ratio.

Idk if i mentioned already in this thread, just increase cost and have him give everyone untouchable for a turn
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Interesting_Socks on September 25, 2016, 07:06:11 PM
Idk if i mentioned already in this thread, just increase cost and have him give everyone untouchable for a turn

Please mention this in as few places as possible, before you ruin our beautiful game.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: ecliptix on September 25, 2016, 08:34:23 PM


EXILES

Wheezer of Smog - Increase stats or reduce cost to 1.


As is, wheezer wins games. Just ask Nuggets :D

Angelify? Nope
Descension? Nope
Upgrade? Nope (Gains you value if it results in a bad block)
Mechborning? Nope
Tinkers? Nope
Siphoners? Double Nope
Shikana Charge? Nope

I'm sure I'm missing more here but those are the big ones that come to mind. Especially that whole "I can block siphoners" thing. That's kinda a big deal.
herald+shikana charge because they don't target.

People still play herald? Also I was thinking shikana + ferocity. Herald is just way too predictable and I feel like its easy to stop with other methods if you see it coming.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Interesting_Socks on September 25, 2016, 09:51:53 PM
People still play herald? Also I was thinking shikana + ferocity. Herald is just way too predictable and I feel like its easy to stop with other methods if you see it coming.

Only in 3 FD, because it lacks any burst damage.

Herald does have some advantages over ferocity, it lets you Shikana on turn 6. While it is predictable, a lot of decks still can't do anything about it. You can also use Herald to bluff Shikana, which normally buys you a turn. Herald on turn 8 for example is very threatening, because on turn 9 you could either Shikana or ramp to Calamity.
Title: Re: The New Balance Team
Post by: Hiding on October 12, 2016, 04:31:08 PM
Random idea, make Burden of Command more usable by allowing it to target any card in play. Makes it a bit more useful esp vs champions.

[also maybe help it combo with Dehumanize or Monster Hunt??]